One of the GreatChallengesToWikis The emigration of parts from wiki pages and discussions, which are not tightly related to the WikiMission, to the new world. Essentially an OffTopic discussion is moved off the wiki, usually to another wiki but could be another medium. Assumed to have only been observed with OverwhelmingTopic''''s. There are two forms of WikiEmigration: *Keeping old content from the originating wiki *Removing old content from the originating wiki Contrast StartAgain, where the people who are tightly focused on the original mission move, and the off-topic folks stay. '''Symptoms:''' *A WikiEmigration tends to be a pretty public affair with SystemNotices and e-mail used to inform everyone involved '''Consequences:''' Not everyone may agree with the appropriateness of the move, or how the move is done. The event is challenging because it affects many Wikizens but the impact on the community has not been observed to be too severe. '''Examples:''' *In 1996 there was a WikiEmigration of tax lawyers and accountants to BridgesWiki [http://c2.com:8000/] (see Wiki:WikiBridge) *Wiki:ExtremeProgramming to the Wiki:XpMailingList, newsgroups, conferences, etc. *WikiOnWiki to MeatballWiki *Christianity to AndStuffWiki and WhyClublet *Various topics from WikiPedia to WiktionaryProject, WikiBooks, WikiQuote, WikiSource, WikiSpecies, WikiNews and assorted WikiCities '''Treatments:''' *Ensure that there is a reasonable effort that all participations in the emigrating topic are informed of the move *AnonymizingNotConsideredHarmful '''References:''' Wiki:WikiEmigration ---- What are the issues here? Could technology help? Would the "emigration" concept even make sense if we had InterWiki, TransClusion and a VersionHistory system? By versioning I mean that, eg, WhyClublet could link to an old copy of one of WardsWiki pages, and (perhaps) could continue doing so even after that content has been deleted (apparently) from WardsWiki itself. By TransClusion I mean that the content would be served from WardsWiki but appear seamlessly embedded in WhyClublet pages. Versioning leads to the notion of content being immutable, which helps efficiency in the form of data replication/caching. The content may be conceptually and ultimately served from WardsWiki but the final page assembled and cached on WhyClublet. The difference between the "right to link" and the "right to copy" becomes subtle and perhaps not useful. I gather some people have objected to WikiEmigration on the grounds of lack of a unified RecentChanges. That is, they wanted to know what edits were being made in the other place, what comments were being said about them, and they didn't want to have to check the WhyClublet RecentChanges to find out. With better InterWiki technology (UnifiedRecentChanges) this problem might go away. ''I'd tend to believe that better InterWiki technology would make this problem go away. But it's not here yet. I'd also think that UnifiedRecentChanges is not such a simple thing to do well. I'd definitely like to see someone attempt it though. -- JasonYip'' Ask DaveJacoby to show you his RichSiteSummary for MeatballWiki. Repeat for other wikis. Done. Actually, the whole point of the RichSiteSummary is to be able to paste together dynamic data from a variety of sites, wikis being only a subset. Pretty cool, eh? ---- The copyright problems boggle the mind. Versioning is not a solution. Why should the one site have special access to the wiki that other external referals don't? Actually, there is a good argument that these copies of the material aren't part of the system proper and thus permission is not granted to reproduce them in this way. Moreover, permission to redistribute may not extend this far. My suggested solution--because it has so many advantages--is * Only copy the pages you have permission to copy; * Even then, only copy the important bits (e.g. I copied the CollectiveIntelligence headers, etc. because I wrote them, but not any of my other comments on them); * If you want to refer to a page from the old wiki, use an InterWiki link; * If you want to copy content from the old wiki, write a summary, quoting only in fair use; * Place links to the new location from the old location to reverse the WikiGravitationalEffect. This avoid the copyright problems plus gives you an excellent excuse to rework all the threaded spaghetti and page ravioli when summarizing. Moreover, because it's so much work, you will likely only copy the important bits, not the irrelevant fluff. This is why Wiki:CrcCards work so well, and why writing with pen and paper is superior than a word processor. Then, your site will have the greater value and the old site can twist in pasta hell. ;) -- SunirShah ---- After reflecting on this for a while, I realize I don't like having to think about copyright when dealing with wikis... at least in terms of thinking of permission rather than respect. It seems to violate WikiEssence or something. Need to think about this some more. -- JasonYip ''Read the MeatballWikiCopyrightDiscussion. What's your reaction to that?'' I notice that Ward does not declare a policy but only describes intent. : There is a [http://c2.com/ppr/about/copyright.html policy]. ---- See also WikiLifeCycle [CategoryWikiConventions] [CategoryInterCommunity]